writing thoughts

[cornerofmadness]

After seeing the word nano bantered about last week I had to go look it up...hmm writing a 50,000 word novel in a month. I've been since trying to figure out the advantages of this and have to admit I see very few beyond, the novel's done...and even that's not really true. Most publishers/agents won't look at anything under 75,000. In a month you'll get 50,000 words, most of it shit, no doubt. The site readily admits that. This isn't something you could shove on a resume. I'm not sure an agent would be impressed you whipped something out in a month (okay granted no one is going to just submit it after this, everyone would, one imagines, then take the time to fiddle with it and improve it, add those 25,000 words that are needed etc).

Okay so I have a novel. I've also deprived myself of the basic joy of writing one, ie. watching the characters grow, spending time with them and relishing their story. Does this reflect in the writing? I'm sure it would. Oh course, probably one of the points of this whole exercise is to get away from enjoying hte characters so much you never finish you novel. THat happens a lot.

So would i try this? I don't know. I know I can write 50,000 words in a month. I routinuely write 30-50K every month, mostly fan crap that gets me nowhere but its fun and I like doing it but sometimes it is at the cost of my original fic.

I think my biggest concern with this exercise is what happens afterwards. Those on my flist who have done this before, can you tell me, do they plan on putting this up on their site somewhere? (I tried to find it but when your dial up slows to 2 kbps on a regular basis, it's not possible to navigate anything. If they do, then absolutely not. I wouldn't do this. Posting entire novels (or links there to) can take you out of the running for ever selling the thing and there's not point in writing it (for me) if I couldn't market it.

On the other hand, if they don't post it, it could be an interesting exercise even though I know I probably have enough commitments already that I wouldn't get it done.

Comments

[evil-little-dog.livejournal.com]

Don't you churn out more than 50,000 by drawing breath?

*ducks*

[cornerofmadness.livejournal.com]

SHUT UP

[leni-ba.livejournal.com]

But you know she's right... :-P

[cornerofmadness.livejournal.com]

Don't make me come down there. Was thinking about you today watching someone roast coffee beans. God that smells good

[evil-little-dog.livejournal.com]

Thanks, Leni - I knew I wouldn't be the ONLY one to think this!!!!

*wraps arm around Leni, sticks tongue out at COM*

[evil-little-dog.livejournal.com]

*snicker*

[cornerofmadness.livejournal.com]

go read. You missed this one
http://www.livejournal.com/users/cornerofmadness/80385.html

[vampedvixen.livejournal.com]

It's really more of a writing exercise than something that will further a person's career. More in the vein of "mostly [..] crap that gets me nowhere but its fun and I like doing it" then "I'm going to be a published success!" Like the adage goes, you have to write a lot of crap before you can start writing well. I did nano last year, and a few unofficial ones since then (in April and July). Even though I'll never sell a book (nor do I want to) I believe my writing has become better since participating in these exercises. And whether you can put that on a resume or not, writing better will still help in the professional field.

Plus, it's just a first draft. It's supposed to be crap. When the month is over, most people go back over their drafts and add more to it, delete the bullshit, and make it prettier.. which takes a hell of a lot longer. November is not the month to get it right, it's the month to get it written. And a lot of people, without having the community nano provides, wouldn't even have the strength of will needed to get the first draft done. They just keep putting it off, procrastinating and never do a thing about the story they have in their head.

It's a great way of networking too, because there are regional meetups and parties so you can meet writers in your area.

There have been some novels from nano published, but a lot of people just write because it's a hobby not because the have pipe dreams of becoming an author and making lots and lots of money. Basically, it's just fun.. and crazy!

Also, to answer your question..

[vampedvixen.livejournal.com]

No, they don't put the novels up on their site. For one, they don't have the space and for two, they know some people will go forward to try to publish their novels and they don't want to mess up their chances in the market.

Re: Also, to answer your question..

[cornerofmadness.livejournal.com]

AH there it is, thanks. See, now that's a relief. Now I'm considering it...someone stop me now

[vampedvixen.livejournal.com]

*giggles maniacally*

[cornerofmadness.livejournal.com]

I can see all those points, yes thank you. Still, do you know if they post this thing up? I'm willing to concede the first chapter but not the story should I get it down if I even decide to do this.

[makd.livejournal.com]

Interestingly, when you take your series' lengths, they are novels. So, you've done this....

Can you use the exercise to finish WIPs, or does it have to be "fresh"?

Just trying to aid in the decision-making process, which I've now probably screwed up! ;-\

[cornerofmadness.livejournal.com]

The idea is it's fresh one month doing 50,000 words. Oh yeah, I've done novels. I'm professionally shopping two right now, not an easy task as I already knew.

I could probably do this and have if not something done, something a lot further along than where I am now. WOuld probably have to be in the horror/fantasy genre instead of mystery since I'd need more time to plot that (I tend to write blends of both)

[cornerofmadness.livejournal.com]

I'm somewhere between your take on this and thinking, I know I work better if I have a deadline and a challenge. Hmmmm. I tend to write in stages anyhow, first i just get it out there. Then go back layer in description and then worry about if it's shit or not. I think, as you say, this is more a motivational thing than anything else. There are a ton of us who just can't motivate themselves. I do get that way frmo time to time. Kicks self

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

I had pretty severe writer's block earlier this summer where I couldn't pick up my novel if I tried. I still can't work on my novel, but my desire to write has come back as strong as ever, and I realize what was blocking me with my novel was burn out, and the tediousness of editing, as opposed to the more fun creation process. Plus, the realization that the next step was submitting it to possible agents--having other people judge my fiction writing--made me unable to get it to that point where I could consider it "done".

I've always felt I was a good writer and improving over the years as I worked on my fiction. But that was just my own opinion. The one thing I lack is confidence that other people will like my fiction writing. That's why I've been working on my novel for so long, being productive at it, but never finishing it to send it off to potential agents.

Now with this fanfic, The Destroyer, I may be writing fanfic, but since I've never done that before to speak of, it's new for me, and it's giving me the one thing my novel really didn't--an audience. That's kind of motivating, because people are expecting to see more new episodes, so there's the deadline thing and the expectation thing. That's worked well for me in the past with non-fiction stuff like with my BtVS/AtS website, where I did regular analyses of BtVS and AtS episodes. Once I had an audience, I found that a HUGE motivator for completing things.

On the other hand, at first I had to fight my fear of letting other people see my writing. That's why I wasn't telling anyone about it. I didn't want people to read it because my fear of their reaction would give me instant writer's block. Then as it was fairly well received by the few friends I had reading it, I started to NEED more attention to it to feel motivated to continue.

I can write with or without other people's feedback (I had an editor working with me on my novel for a while, but only for one--not the first!--draft). The fun of putting words together is enough to get me to the keyboard if the project is a good one that I have a passion for.

But in the end, I don't think it's enough. When you like your own writing, you want other people to see it. And that's the thing I have to work on now.

[cornerofmadness.livejournal.com]

I've been pretty blocked on some of my novels too. One I'm cowriting with someone and I'm not so much blocked as she is and the scenes mostly left are hers. BUT with school and thesis I didn't have the time to put into my original fic. fanfic I can toss off easily. I know the rules. I don't have to make them up.

You have a good point about the fun of creation. That's one of the big drawbacks I see to this novel in a month thing. There's not much joy there (but I'm considering a novel in my own series where I know the characters already)

It wasn't giving it to an agent and having someone judge it that kept me from getting a couple of mine done. The problem? I loved the characters so much I didn't want to let them go.

I've always felt I was good too but since I've had to put my stuff out there since I was 10 I never really developed the fear of what others think. Sure it hurts when they don't like it. I've been told i'm the worse writer going by some people in fandom. I ignore them. I'm the one with professional credits, not them (not to mention he tried to tell how to do an autopsy when I've done dozens and that red dirt was a physical impossibility)

I'm not sure how to build confidence though since I definitely lack it in other areas. I think getting the Destroyer out there might help you gain a little. surely someone might flame you (Connor being an unpopular character to many) but usually you come through stronger for it. I'm glad having an audience is a big motivator. I find it so too, not disappointing people (such as with these ficathons I'm doing)

But yes, you do need to get it out there. I have people in my writers groups who DONT want published. They're writing for fun. I can see that. What I can't see is why are they in a by-mail group that costs $$$ for something they never want to profit from.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

I've talked about nanowrimo with other people on LJ because I've never given it a thought before, and many of the people on my Flist and in the writing communties I belong to talk about it like it's "The THING we all do". wtf??

I never understood the appeal of it--me with my Obsessive-Compulsive-Writing-Syndrome, who spends every waking hour I'm not working for a living or being dragged out by friends and forced to socialize at my computer (or with my pen and pad of paper). Counting words seems useless if every word you wrote to day was crap.

Talking to people on my Flist and in the writing communies, I get the impression that NaNoWriMo is like a big group motivational thing that helps people who have writer's block, or who have always wanted to start that novel but never did, actually put some words on paper. A "We're all in this together and supporting each other" kind of thing. "I wrote 5000 words today!" "Yeah on you! I wrote 2000!"

So I just sit back and say, "Hey, if it works for you, cool." I am well versed in the Natalie Goldberg writing tradition that says the way to get yourself to write is to just sit down and write and not worry about the quality of what comes out, at least not in the initial stages. Free thinking, free writing, ban the judgmental editor, and all that.

As for me, I'll just continue to suck up to and make obeisance to my muses, the little bastards, because there but for the grace of them go I. ; )

[esmerelda-t.livejournal.com]

hmmm, my initial reaction was writing a book in the month is the way we got Sweet Valley High, and every Angel/Buffy tie in novel. But then, that's how I write essays, a rough draft, and then I work on it, seems to have worked for me so far.

Still there's a difference in writing an essay, and writing a novel, not least in length, for a start I tend not to need to pull stuff out the air to write an essay, but its based on stuff I already know and the random bit of inspiration that comes while Im writing down what I actually know about the subject, soooooo, Id say, that if you want to be a writer, and are at a loose end for a month, then it'd be something to try, just for the hell of it, and you might at the end of it have something worth working more on, but if you arent really at that loose of an end, I suppose it comes down to a question of time managment.

Did any of that make any sense? Casue it sure as hell didnt make sense to me. Gonna change my online name to Little Miss Rambles. :)

[cornerofmadness.livejournal.com]

THanks Little Miss Rambles. It makes sense. I figure it this way, I'm under no pressure to actually finish it if I decide to do this. But you're right most of teh Buffy/Angel tie ins feel like they were written in a month. Hell most people on the best sellar list only get 3 months total to do another novel once they're big and famous (and it shows)

[esmerelda-t.livejournal.com]

Well, it only took Goethe something like, oh, his whole life, to write Faust...... so maybe there is something to this deadline lark? ;)

Where Leni rambles...

[leni-ba.livejournal.com]

I mentioned signing up for nanowrimo months ago. I know I need a push like that because I need to learn to write more than 1500 words for a story. That's half the reason my WIPs never got done.

Back in June 2000 words per day sounded reasonable, I wrote at least a drabble daily and I had more ideas than I could count. I know that I could do it if I had the time. But I tend to check every detail as I write. As tempting as a non-restrictions policy sounds, I don't know if I can do it. I'd have to readjust my whole approach to writing and try to look at the 'big picture' of a plot, not just the 'instants' I always use for my fiction.

Then there's the issue of time. For ~2000 words I'd need at least one hour daily. At least. Even though I have already cleared all of November (except for the IWRY thing), I still am not sure if I'll find all that time.

For now I know that I'll consider signing up only if I finish all the ficathon stories (bth, c/d, d/s, cya, w/x) until the deadline. I won't be able to handle 2000 words plus more must-do stories.

Re: Where Leni rambles...

[cornerofmadness.livejournal.com]

I honestly don't remember that but then again half the time people's posts appear at random somewhere in the collection of posts and I miss them.

It would certainly be a different way of writing for both of us. I'm a compulsive re-editor. I have trouble moving on sometimes.

BUt like you I've got SO many ficathons to do it's not funny. I need to stop that. Seriously. I need to concentrate more on original fic

Re: Where Leni rambles...

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

I'm a compulsive re-editor. I have trouble moving on sometimes.

Ah! You just nailed the problem I'm having finishing my novel TO THE WALL!