Angel Ficathon
May. 30th, 2004 09:43 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
cornerofmadness![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif){kind=small}
theantijoss said the masterlist would be up sometime today for those of us who got it done for the original date (which suited me better given my schedule. I wrote for itsabigrock who wanted the following:
Pairing: Angelus/Darla (Angel/Spike is always fine too)
Genre You Prefer: I like Dark, Evil, well researched, Plot Driven, Smut is good, slash is good.
Requests: Any time before the soul, I have a carriage kink, lol.
Restrictions: No bashing of Drusilla, if you can't write her don't write her, just don't make her out to be an idiot, no babytalk, they're evil.
No problem. I do love writing historical fic though I'm not as good with Angelus as I am with Spike/Dru (as much as I adore Angelus I find him difficult to write, much more difficult than Spike for some reason). I'm pretty happy with this story. It'll probably get more polishing before it hits my website so suggestions are welcome. It IS NC-17 (evil vampires here, rape, murder and mayhem are part and parcel). It's nearly 11,000 words long (sigh)
So without further ado here's Dance With the Devil in the Pale Moonlight (extra points to those who know which movie/character I stole the title from)
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 07:10 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 08:27 am (UTC)*thinking*
It sounds so familiar......
no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 08:29 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 09:22 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 09:25 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 10:30 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 10:31 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 10:57 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 10:57 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 11:24 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 01:17 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 02:27 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-30 04:36 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-31 02:33 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-31 02:46 pm (UTC)I can always remove the erotica for you. These are two rather vile creatures which is why I went that route and I'm sorry you didn't like it but I'd rather know that than not hear from you at all. I didn't gather from your request that you were interested in a more romantic thing with these two.
no subject
Date: 2004-05-31 07:53 pm (UTC)The things I'm thinking of are little things really, the tobacco Lords wouldn't probably have been called barons, the word 'corset' didn't come into use until about 30 years later, etc.
As for the smut, I think it's some of the modern jargon I find jarring. Angelus thinking someone was cute, that just wouldn't be a thought going through his mind.
Really in the end I think the biggest distractions were things like here are the players, here is our plan, here are a few minutes of the plan in action, here's the word maid twenty times, lol. I was in a cranky mood when I read it and I kind of wanted it to jump into the action instead of telling me about the action.
It just needs a little work, a beta reading, maybe an outside perspective. Like I said I *will* try to read it again, just not tonight with a migraine.
no subject
Date: 2004-05-31 08:19 pm (UTC)Tobacco baron is about the only term I found in about seven different books and countless online sources. Now, would they have been called barons in their actualy day probably not but they were certainly the elite of Glasgow and I have no idea what they would have been called by their peers.
I WAS going to make a note about the modern jargon. I didn't have time to go back and remove some of teh anacrhonisms and a lot of people hate that so I let it slide like the word cute. Like I said, not really knowing what you wanted (that IS a falling down of these ficathons, I'm just as guilty of vagueness as the next person) I went with them being as base and disgusting as they could be. He's the Scourage of Europe so I aimed for that.
no subject
Date: 2004-05-31 08:45 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-05-31 09:03 pm (UTC)Thanks for being understanding about the feedback issue! We all have different styles and sometimes it's hard to get into something that comes from a style so dissimilar to mine. Sometimes the historical detail just gets in the way. I was talking a bit about this with another writer because she had a hard time getting past the first chapter as well, and I think that some of the backstory details pulled us out of the moment. That and giving Liam a last name, I'm a canon spaz and that just jarred me right the heck out of there, it wasn't necessary to the story so all it did was make me go argh.
I'll stop trying to help now, lol.
no subject
Date: 2004-06-01 02:31 am (UTC)I like the setting though, it's original and a Glaswegian context makes a change from London.
no subject
Date: 2004-06-01 07:01 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-06-01 07:11 am (UTC)Yeah there's always two camps, those who want minimal detail and those who think I haven't done enough with this in that aspect. The latter are being louder.
no subject
Date: 2004-06-01 09:57 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-06-02 01:37 am (UTC)When History Nerds Counter-Attack
I'am one of the historians D.M. Evans consulted for this story. It has been my pleasure and privilege to have worked with her in the past as one of her historical consultants.
While my area of interest and specialty is military history primarily, I did some research on this topic myself and pointed her to several resources.
Given the constraints of time, subject matter and setting I believe she did as good a job as could be done under the circumstances.
Doubtless some editing is desired by the author.
This is usually the case.
Some minor changes in wording could be made.
Itsabigrock, you seem to have a problem with the term "Tabacco Barons". You think it is some 30 years out of place yet I fail to see you recommend a more historically accurate one. I failed to find anything better in my research, neither did D.M. Evans or her other historical advisors.
So what would you recommend?
Nouvaeau Riches perhaps?
I think not...too long...too pretentious...too French. Besides, I believe it didn't come into general useage until the 19th century. By which time, according to you, they would have already been long referred to as tabacco barons.
How about Tabacco Burghers then? (Mmmm Burghers...:)
This is somewhat better but still, to my mind, inferior to barons.
So in your own research could you recommend something more historically appropriate?
I agree with you somewhat more on the matter of "cute".
But yet again, you fail to constructively recommend a better alternative.
Comely? Handsome? (which in those days was applied to females as well as males).
If you have any better, historically correct adjectives then please, by all means recommend them.
Beyond questions of historical phrasing, however, The bigger problem, as I see it, here is thus:
Itsabigrock, I don't think you really know what exactly you wanted this story to be.
Did you want a Harlot-Quinn style pulp romance? A Boddace Ripper? Or horror erotica A lA Anne Rice?
If you are vague on what you want...if you are unsure even in your own mind, then how can the author be fairly blamed for not meeting your expectations.
Criticism is easy...ART is difficult.
Good day Madam.
Re: When History Nerds Counter-Attack
Date: 2004-06-02 07:42 am (UTC)The biggest challenge with this ficathon was that there were authors coming from so many corners of fandom that very few had actually read each other's work or journals enough to know the styles, loves, etc. of those they were writing for. This is just one of the inherent downfalls to the ficathon process.
Historical fiction written from a twenty-first century perspective with modern jargon is not something I generally enjoy. It pulls the reader from the moment and I have a hard time getting back into the mood and feel after being jarred out. It's frightening the power a few words scattered here and there can have on a historical story. Luckily I think that like myself DM considers each piece a work in progress and always open to reworking, which means that as authors we can take all the comments into consideration and incorporating them into the piece.
Tobacco Lords (if one must define the man at all) would be more acceptable in the historical context.
As for what I had in mind the ficathon only gave a few things one could request so putting in exactly what sort of mood etc. wasn't really an option, such is life. DM was fair enough to warn she had struggles writing Angelus so it is through no fault of her own that she was asked to write him. I never meant to tear the story to shreds, it just didn't hit my buttons, I'm sure there are plenty of readers who will enjoy it I just couldn't get past the breaks in canon (because that's what I prefer) and using words like 'last squirts' of anything are the quickest way I've found yet to make me stop reading. I want to read it, I wouldn't even mind giving it a proper beta, but at this point I think we've established that there are many opinions and comments that will help her best decide how she wants to work her final edit. I'm just glad she was open to honest comments and hopefully she knows that it is in no way a critisism of her, just this one piece.
Re: When History Nerds Counter-Attack
Date: 2004-06-02 10:16 am (UTC)Like I said, you asked for evil vampires so I saw no reason to pretty them up. Darla/Angelus have always been shown as violent sexually especially toward each other.
Sorry that didn't work out for you but I'll confess to being a little put out by it. I don't think you intended to come across as a little rude but given the response here and privately,it was taken that way. But I'm okay with that since it'll hardly be the first or last time someone didn't like something I've written (you should see some of the comments I've received on my professional stuff). I don't think I'll be changing much in this story, quite frankly (beyond the expurgated version that will appear on FFN) since I think it's pretty true to the characters and the time period. And since it's not your type of story, I don't think some small amounts of fiddling with it would make it to your taste so that would just be an exercise in futility. Given that in ficathons you are lucky if you get 50% of your requests done another one in the loss column isn't that much of a difference.
Sorry it didn't work out better.
no subject
Date: 2004-06-02 10:29 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-06-02 10:30 am (UTC)Re: When History Nerds Counter-Attack
Date: 2004-06-02 10:36 am (UTC)Re: When History Nerds Counter-Attack
Date: 2004-06-02 03:40 pm (UTC)And you're right, a little tinkering may not make it my favorite piece ever, but I will give it another look none-the-less. I've archived your stories before and very well may want future stories to put beside them. I have stories of my own that I love and others I hate so I never give up on myself or others simply because of one story. I wish there was a magic way to make my words express what it as that my brain was thinking when I read it the first time, it just doesn't always want to cooperate.
I had a whole thing I started to say here, but I think I'm done, lol. I don't want to spam your LJ anymore with vague things that probably won't explain my vibe very well. I'm sorry.
Re: When History Nerds Counter-Attack
Date: 2004-06-02 04:03 pm (UTC)I'm okay with you not liking the story, really. There are things we read by our favorite authors out there and we sit and wonder what was that? And yeah, guess that's all that really needs to be said.
Re: When History Nerds Counter-Attack
I was merely suggesting that it would be more fair of you, as a critic and writer yourself, to perhaps cut the author "some slack":)
Especially given, as you say, the inherient limitations of a ficathon, your admitted unfamilarity with D.M Evan's work, plus the fact it is clearly a work in progress.
I also appreciate the thoughtful and civil nature of your reply and that you did take up my "gauntlet" to make a constructive suggestion:
"Tobacco Lords (if one must define the man at all) would be more acceptable in the historical context."
I conceed that, though technically it would only be truly valid if one were a member of the titled aristocracy. This was, afterall, the mid 1700's, and the old feudal titles still ment something. This made them a valuable commodity which could be purchased either from a hard-up aristocractic family or by greasing the right palms in court or parliament.
(As demonstrated in the novel and film Barry Lyndon)
Re: When History Nerds Counter-Attack
As I've told you in the past (perhaps too many times:)I admire those who have a gift for creating quality fiction.
As for cheating...I won't tell if you won't;)
Re: When History Nerds Counter-Attack
Date: 2004-06-04 10:01 pm (UTC)Re: When History Nerds Counter-Attack
You're entitled;)